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	<title>Comments on: Is Sponsorship a Sin?</title>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-301</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 27 Nov 2009 02:12:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-301</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Landon.

If you&#039;re going to elect yourself to be the literary critic, then I suggest that you pay closer attention to the words on the screen. It&#039;s important to read all of them if you&#039;re going to comment.

As I&#039;ve said repeatedly here and elsewhere -- although perhaps in not clear enough language, or perhaps in not big enough or bold enough text -- I have no problem with sponsorship, marketing or self-promotion. I have a problem with facades and bullshit. And too many sponsored climbers base their careers on both.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Landon.</p>
<p>If you&#8217;re going to elect yourself to be the literary critic, then I suggest that you pay closer attention to the words on the screen. It&#8217;s important to read all of them if you&#8217;re going to comment.</p>
<p>As I&#8217;ve said repeatedly here and elsewhere &#8212; although perhaps in not clear enough language, or perhaps in not big enough or bold enough text &#8212; I have no problem with sponsorship, marketing or self-promotion. I have a problem with facades and bullshit. And too many sponsored climbers base their careers on both.</p>
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		<title>By: Adam</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-300</link>
		<dc:creator>Adam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Nov 2009 16:50:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-300</guid>
		<description>I am a mountaineering instructor that recieves sponsorship.  I don&#039;t have to do anything in return for this support, and I only use the equipment that I feel is best for the job.  The working relationship I have with my sponsors is excellent, and the opportunity to feedback on the kit they supply is brilliant, from a professional point of veiw.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a mountaineering instructor that recieves sponsorship.  I don&#039;t have to do anything in return for this support, and I only use the equipment that I feel is best for the job.  The working relationship I have with my sponsors is excellent, and the opportunity to feedback on the kit they supply is brilliant, from a professional point of veiw.</p>
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		<title>By: Landon</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-299</link>
		<dc:creator>Landon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Nov 2009 06:02:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-299</guid>
		<description>Well, I would say that you&#039;re not a literary genius either.  Certainly not one of the greatest writers or thinkers of our time.  Does that mean that you writing about your ideas or self-promotion of your opinion is immoral? Is your blog or presentation on this subject reducing the legitimacy of the literary culture?

BTW, not trying to be offensive here, just trying to make a point.

In any business you have to market yourself, if you hope for someone random to do it you will surely go out of business.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I would say that you&#8217;re not a literary genius either.  Certainly not one of the greatest writers or thinkers of our time.  Does that mean that you writing about your ideas or self-promotion of your opinion is immoral? Is your blog or presentation on this subject reducing the legitimacy of the literary culture?</p>
<p>BTW, not trying to be offensive here, just trying to make a point.</p>
<p>In any business you have to market yourself, if you hope for someone random to do it you will surely go out of business.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-302</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Nov 2009 10:54:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-302</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Dave. I agree that this is not unusual, and it&#039;s just the case of unscrupulous marketing making it&#039;s way into the climbing industry.

However… I must disagree with the following:

&lt;em&gt;&quot;With regard to the mediocre accomplishments, I think the companies will wise up before long and drop whoever.&quot;
&lt;/em&gt;
Unfortunately, this is not the case. Several very well-known brands are already well-aware of some of their athletes&#039; insubstantial resumes, but they&#039;re banking on consumer naïveté. They&#039;ve realized that the average climber thinks that all sponsorships are warranted — i.e. If someone&#039;s sponsored, then it must be deserved — so it becomes a self-justifying marketing game with nothing substantial to base it on.

This is especially obvious when website bios are long-winded, but say nothing of technical skill (grades) nor of significant contributions (coveted first ascents). Usually the self-authored drivel focuses on &quot;starting from an early age&quot;, &quot;passionate about the sport&quot;, &quot;seeing life clearly&quot; and other such unsubstantiated nonsense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Dave. I agree that this is not unusual, and it&#8217;s just the case of unscrupulous marketing making it&#8217;s way into the climbing industry.</p>
<p>However… I must disagree with the following:</p>
<p><em>&#8220;With regard to the mediocre accomplishments, I think the companies will wise up before long and drop whoever.&#8221;<br />
</em><br />
Unfortunately, this is not the case. Several very well-known brands are already well-aware of some of their athletes&#8217; insubstantial resumes, but they&#8217;re banking on consumer naïveté. They&#8217;ve realized that the average climber thinks that all sponsorships are warranted — i.e. If someone&#8217;s sponsored, then it must be deserved — so it becomes a self-justifying marketing game with nothing substantial to base it on.</p>
<p>This is especially obvious when website bios are long-winded, but say nothing of technical skill (grades) nor of significant contributions (coveted first ascents). Usually the self-authored drivel focuses on &#8220;starting from an early age&#8221;, &#8220;passionate about the sport&#8221;, &#8220;seeing life clearly&#8221; and other such unsubstantiated nonsense.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-298</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Nov 2009 00:11:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-298</guid>
		<description>Thanks for posting some interesting thoughts on this subject.  I&#039;d only add a couple things (from my perspective as a non-pro guy).

First, the company gets a lot out of their climber spraying in the mags, even if it is lies.  This helps the company and the climber, but I agree it hurts the sport.

Second, it is marketing.  I can&#039;t stand the rampant prescription drug ads on tv, but marketing on the continent is just too effective and life controlling.  A less than attractive climber doesn&#039;t have the greatest chance.  We are marketing good looking people.  Compare the percentage of photos of female climbers in mags to the percentage of women you see at the crags.  Lotsa chicks in the mags.

Part of the marketing angle, but pros and photographers have a strong symbiosis... some more than others.

WIth regard to the mediocre accomplishments, I think the companies will wise up before long and drop whoever.

I think that&#039;s about it except for the fact that it&#039;s all pretty theoretical at this point.  Lots of climbers get free shoes/gear/schwag but no money.  Is that a problem? There is definitely status attached to just getting free shoes.  Personally, I hope it never goes the way of surfing, where you got lots of 6 figure moneymen and the accompanying paparazzi, I think that&#039; would be super lame.  But, if you want to change it, YOU GOTTA NAME NAMES.  And I have a feeling you&#039;re not going there.  Not much would be accomplished...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for posting some interesting thoughts on this subject.  I&#039;d only add a couple things (from my perspective as a non-pro guy).</p>
<p>First, the company gets a lot out of their climber spraying in the mags, even if it is lies.  This helps the company and the climber, but I agree it hurts the sport.</p>
<p>Second, it is marketing.  I can&#039;t stand the rampant prescription drug ads on tv, but marketing on the continent is just too effective and life controlling.  A less than attractive climber doesn&#039;t have the greatest chance.  We are marketing good looking people.  Compare the percentage of photos of female climbers in mags to the percentage of women you see at the crags.  Lotsa chicks in the mags.</p>
<p>Part of the marketing angle, but pros and photographers have a strong symbiosis&#8230; some more than others.</p>
<p>WIth regard to the mediocre accomplishments, I think the companies will wise up before long and drop whoever.</p>
<p>I think that&#039;s about it except for the fact that it&#039;s all pretty theoretical at this point.  Lots of climbers get free shoes/gear/schwag but no money.  Is that a problem? There is definitely status attached to just getting free shoes.  Personally, I hope it never goes the way of surfing, where you got lots of 6 figure moneymen and the accompanying paparazzi, I think that&#039; would be super lame.  But, if you want to change it, YOU GOTTA NAME NAMES.  And I have a feeling you&#039;re not going there.  Not much would be accomplished&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: &#8220;It&#8217;s up to the company to decide.&#8221; — Massive Mouse</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-297</link>
		<dc:creator>&#8220;It&#8217;s up to the company to decide.&#8221; — Massive Mouse</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 21:07:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-297</guid>
		<description>[...] Friday, I presented a fun slideshow called &#8220;Is Sponsorship a Sin?&#8221; at Canmore&#8217;s [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Friday, I presented a fun slideshow called &#8220;Is Sponsorship a Sin?&#8221; at Canmore&#8217;s [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Just Sinful — ScottSemple.com</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-296</link>
		<dc:creator>Just Sinful — ScottSemple.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Nov 2009 17:17:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-296</guid>
		<description>[...] October 30th, I presented &#8220;Is Sponsorship a Sin?&#8221; at the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] October 30th, I presented &#8220;Is Sponsorship a Sin?&#8221; at the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-303</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 21:26:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-303</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Rob. No problem with the question. If I am questioning others, then I must put myself up for examination as well.

WRT the route we did, do you mean Mt. Stephen? I think that that&#039;s a worthwhile tick. Often looked at, but didn&#039;t get done until we did it. Hasn&#039;t been done since, I think?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Rob. No problem with the question. If I am questioning others, then I must put myself up for examination as well.</p>
<p>WRT the route we did, do you mean Mt. Stephen? I think that that&#8217;s a worthwhile tick. Often looked at, but didn&#8217;t get done until we did it. Hasn&#8217;t been done since, I think?</p>
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		<title>By: Rob Owens</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-290</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob Owens</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 05:59:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-290</guid>
		<description>HI Scott,
    Thanks for answering my,  probably written while drunk (based on the last 2 weeks), questions. Most importantly, I don&#039;t want to suggest that you intentionally over hyped any of your accomplishments but was  admitting that, in retrospect, certain press on some of my climbs, one of which you were involved in, got press despite the fact that they weren&#039;t pushing any new limits. In that particular case you and I were both &#039;sponsored&#039; so we pitched the climb as &#039;news&#039; to some magazines and they ran it. We didn&#039;t deviate from the truth but maybe the magazines aren&#039;t always the best judge of newsworthy topics. We didn&#039;t reach any new spiritual or physical heights on that particular climb but thought someone might be interested. Perhaps because we were &#039;sponsored&#039; the mags assumed it was newsworthy....Vicious circle.
Ultimately I agree with you and can see how many disillusioned climbers there are out there. I can also sympathize with the young, passionate climber that wants to be a professional because all they want to do is climb....everyday. On that note, I believe that as soon as the accomplishment is pitched as &#039;news&#039; it is cheapened. The curse of the professional climber.
Fodder.
Look forward to the presentation....and a beer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>HI Scott,<br />
    Thanks for answering my,  probably written while drunk (based on the last 2 weeks), questions. Most importantly, I don&#039;t want to suggest that you intentionally over hyped any of your accomplishments but was  admitting that, in retrospect, certain press on some of my climbs, one of which you were involved in, got press despite the fact that they weren&#039;t pushing any new limits. In that particular case you and I were both &#039;sponsored&#039; so we pitched the climb as &#039;news&#039; to some magazines and they ran it. We didn&#039;t deviate from the truth but maybe the magazines aren&#039;t always the best judge of newsworthy topics. We didn&#039;t reach any new spiritual or physical heights on that particular climb but thought someone might be interested. Perhaps because we were &#039;sponsored&#039; the mags assumed it was newsworthy&#8230;.Vicious circle.<br />
Ultimately I agree with you and can see how many disillusioned climbers there are out there. I can also sympathize with the young, passionate climber that wants to be a professional because all they want to do is climb&#8230;.everyday. On that note, I believe that as soon as the accomplishment is pitched as &#039;news&#039; it is cheapened. The curse of the professional climber.<br />
Fodder.<br />
Look forward to the presentation&#8230;.and a beer.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.scottsemple.com/is-sponsorship-a-sin/comment-page-1/#comment-304</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Oct 2009 03:39:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.scottsemple.com/?p=497#comment-304</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Todd. Pimping is definitely an important and necessary part of sponsorship. I have no problem with self-promotion. I did a lot of it myself when I was sponsored, and I would again.

My beef is with self-promotion without anything to back it up. Funnily enough, 99% of climbing sponsorships are gear-only, so blaming it on the temptation of money doesn&#039;t follow.

I suspect it has more to do with some internal need for recognition on the part of the pretenders in spite of it revealing them as frauds.

Again, I have no problem with self-promotion. I think it&#039;s a smart thing to do in most careers. But if someone is gonna hype themselves, they better have the money to back up their mouth (so to speak).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Todd. Pimping is definitely an important and necessary part of sponsorship. I have no problem with self-promotion. I did a lot of it myself when I was sponsored, and I would again.</p>
<p>My beef is with self-promotion without anything to back it up. Funnily enough, 99% of climbing sponsorships are gear-only, so blaming it on the temptation of money doesn&#8217;t follow.</p>
<p>I suspect it has more to do with some internal need for recognition on the part of the pretenders in spite of it revealing them as frauds.</p>
<p>Again, I have no problem with self-promotion. I think it&#8217;s a smart thing to do in most careers. But if someone is gonna hype themselves, they better have the money to back up their mouth (so to speak).</p>
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